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Old 04-21-2010, 10:20 PM   #31
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i dont understand why people like south park tbh

primary school-level jokes(including poop, sex and racism), weekly pop-culture issue references and animation that is under the quality of flash cartoons.

someone could explain though, im not saying its shit, i just dont see the good side of it

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Old 04-21-2010, 10:21 PM   #32
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Pffft
Those guys know the risks when they do shit like this. They've pissed off plenty of people, religious groups are only a portion of that larger number.

I can't believe this sort of crap always turns into a "fuck religion" kind of deal.
"Hey man, your religion is dumb, don't force your ideas down my throat. You're stupid for believing in it, i am smart for not."

There are millions of non violent religious people, and millions of non violent religious people, and a fuckload of the other side too.
Is it that hard to believe?

A prophet is shown in a bear costume. Followers are basically saying they want to murder those responsible. How can it turn into anything BUT a "Fuck religion" thread?

You're right. There are tons of violent people in the world that aren't motivated by religion but this topic is about people motivated by religion.
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Old 04-21-2010, 10:25 PM   #33
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thread should be about why grown men watch cartoons that have jesus defecating on george bush
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Old 04-21-2010, 10:27 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abrogar View Post
i dont understand why people like south park tbh

primary school-level jokes(including poop, sex and racism), weekly pop-culture issue references and animation that is under the quality of flash cartoons.

someone could explain though, im not saying its shit, i just dont see the good side of it
I used to like it, first 4-5 seasons. When it was just mindless toilet humour jokes, etc. But not so much now days. Show still has some magic, but does often delve into angles that actually anger me. Which is why i have no respect for it, and that has reduced my ability to enjoy it - not as much as the diminishing quality (imo) in the episodes, but to a decent degree.

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Originally Posted by entwinedwithsickness View Post
Is it that hard to believe?

A prophet is shown in a bear costume. Followers are basically saying they want to murder those responsible. How can it turn into anything BUT a "Fuck religion" thread?

You're right. There are tons of violent people in the world that aren't motivated by religion but this topic is about people motivated by religion.
Nah, it isn't that hard to believe. It just frustrates me, how quick people are to jump on the bandwagon. People are laughing at folks believing slutty chicks are responsible for earth quakes, yet instantly blame a huge portion of the world's woes on religion. To me, it's a cop out. Accept it's simply due to many humans being shit, and the world will be a happier place...haha

But in addition, surely there's only 1 or 2 people actually mentioned as saying this in that news report?
I doubt there'd be a huge ass load of muslims wanting them legit killed.

How is it any different that all the rednecks (and many non rednecks) in your country saying "fuck the middle east, nuke em all"?

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Old 04-21-2010, 10:31 PM   #35
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ive tried to like it tbh, and only liked 1 episode (the one with the dolphins) but even so, i just cant enjoy it

seems like just curses, violence, criticism and poop without any real purpose, watching it felt like hanging out with a redneck 12yr old
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Old 04-21-2010, 10:39 PM   #36
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seems like just curses, violence, criticism and poop without any real purpose, watching it felt like hanging out with a redneck 12yr old
or posting on a forum
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Old 04-21-2010, 10:39 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Chalky View Post
Nah, it isn't that hard to believe. It just frustrates me, how quick people are to jump on the bandwagon. People are laughing at folks believing slutty chicks are responsible for earth quakes, yet instantly blame a huge portion of the world's woes on religion. To me, it's a cop out. Accept it's simply due to many humans being shit, and the world will be a happier place...haha

But in addition, surely there's only 1 or 2 people actually mentioned as saying this in that news report?
I doubt there'd be a huge ass load of muslims wanting them legit killed.

How is it any different that all the rednecks (and many non rednecks) in your country saying "fuck the middle east, nuke em all"?
You get all of that out of this topic? Anyways...

The earthquake thing was dumb, and incredibly misguided but funny. The fact that anyone still thinks human actions like that lead to natural disasters in 2010 is funny. What are we copping out of here? People here still thought that was dumb and people also think its insane that they're basically threatening murder over something like this. Its just there is no direct threat in the sluts topic, here there is one.

"1 or 2"? Come on Chalky. I know you follow the news, and read newspapers, don't you? There are a hell of a lot more Muslim extremists than "1 or 2" that take this sort of thing extremely seriously. Yes, one or two may be calling for it right now, but I can tell you that a hell of a lot more people get the message than 1 or 2.

The difference is the country bumpkin calling for the middle east to be bombed more than likely isn't going to fly the plane that will do it.

The Muslim extremists on the other hands will do whatever the Quran says to do. They are the most devout of any religion that I know of. If their holy book calls for blood, they will shed it.
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Old 04-21-2010, 11:23 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by entwinedwithsickness View Post
You get all of that out of this topic? Anyways...

The earthquake thing was dumb, and incredibly misguided but funny. The fact that anyone still thinks human actions like that lead to natural disasters in 2010 is funny. What are we copping out of here? People here still thought that was dumb and people also think its insane that they're basically threatening murder over something like this. Its just there is no direct threat in the sluts topic, here there is one.

"1 or 2"? Come on Chalky. I know you follow the news, and read newspapers, don't you? There are a hell of a lot more Muslim extremists than "1 or 2" that take this sort of thing extremely seriously. Yes, one or two may be calling for it right now, but I can tell you that a hell of a lot more people get the message than 1 or 2.

The difference is the country bumpkin calling for the middle east to be bombed more than likely isn't going to fly the plane that will do it.

The Muslim extremists on the other hands will do whatever the Quran says to do. They are the most devout of any religion that I know of. If their holy book calls for blood, they will shed it.
It's 1 or 2 at the moment, and you have no idea how far this will stretch.
I mean, there's been other things crop up the past few years, and hordes of Muslim leaders have come out and denounced what others have said, stating that it is only the extremists who are like that.

And if you wanna look at stats - well, how many people who have been targetted by Muslims in news reports etc have actually been taken out?
People will get mad, people will say shit - i KNOW there are some fucking extreme fuckers out there, i don't doubt it...but more times than not, these things simply don't happen.

Pretty sure the amount of people wiped out in the middle east is a tad higher than the amount of "blasphemers/western infidels" killed muslim extremists too...so, yeah.
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Old 04-21-2010, 11:38 PM   #39
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It's 1 or 2 at the moment, and you have no idea how far this will stretch.
I mean, there's been other things crop up the past few years, and hordes of Muslim leaders have come out and denounced what others have said, stating that it is only the extremists who are like that.

And if you wanna look at stats - well, how many people who have been targetted by Muslims in news reports etc have actually been taken out?
People will get mad, people will say shit - i KNOW there are some fucking extreme fuckers out there, i don't doubt it...but more times than not, these things simply don't happen.

Pretty sure the amount of people wiped out in the middle east is a tad higher than the amount of "blasphemers/western infidels" killed muslim extremists too...so, yeah.
The Dutch cartoonist has had several attempts on his life, once recent. Rushdie has had quite a few attempts on his life. The guy referenced in the article. The woman who now lives in the Netherlands has 24/7 surveilance/security I believe. Oh and 2973 people on 9/11.

and...

Hitoshi Igarashi, the Japanese translator of the book The Satanic Verses, was stabbed to death on July 11, 1991. Two other translators of the book survived attempted assassinations.[55]

Ettore Capriolo, the Italian language translator, was seriously injured in a stabbing the same month as his Japanese counterpart.

Aziz Nesin, the Turkish language translator, was the intended target in the events that led to the Sivas massacre in July 1993, which resulted in the deaths of 37 people.

William Nygaard, the publisher in Norway, barely survived an attempted assassination in Oslo in October 1993.

while we're at it...

One planned attack on Rushdie failed when the would-be bomber, Mustafa Mahmoud Mazeh, blew himself up along with two floors of a central London hotel.

So yeah, while more have died in the middle east in war, they are no saints and there are quite a few who have gone to great lengths to spill blood for their faith.
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Old 04-21-2010, 11:42 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by Abrogar View Post
http://www.islam101.com/terror/christianViolence.htm


both sides are assholes

actually, everyone is an asshole
We all know this, I hope. Christianity just isn't in the discussion here as this is about the extremist Muslims.
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Old 04-22-2010, 12:16 AM   #41
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Matthew Chalk joined the group Tasmanians for Ayatollah Khomeini
3 hours ago · Comment ·LikeUnlike · Join this Group
Haha would be funny
If I had a facebook...
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Old 04-22-2010, 12:20 AM   #42
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If something actually DID happen to Trey and Matt, that would almost be awesome as it might rally more people to proactively sequester religion.

Hitler had the right idea, just the wrong criteria. Fuck genetics, take em out according to the danger of the person's credulity.
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Old 04-22-2010, 12:23 AM   #43
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If you can't see the difference between myopic, hateful, bigoted, (oftentimes Christian) imperialists and the atheist/agnostic/anti-theist who has a REASONED antipathy for one of the most shameful symptoms of human ignorance (but not all the human beings themselves), then I'm afraid you're a wishy-washy apologist. Not that the two are mutually exclusive (well except for being Christian and anti-theist), but there are plenty of good reasons to despise religion that don't also involve being callous toward human beings.
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Old 04-22-2010, 12:37 AM   #44
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naw, I was just being flip.
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Old 04-22-2010, 01:25 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by needs god b/c i'm weak View Post
Pffft
Those guys know the risks when they do shit like this. They've pissed off plenty of people, religious groups are only a portion of that larger number.

I can't believe this sort of crap always turns into a "fuck religion" kind of deal.
"Hey man, your religion is dumb, don't force your ideas down my throat. You're stupid for believing in it, i am smart for not."

There are millions of non violent religious people, and millions of non violent religious people, and a fuckload of the other side too.
Look, here's the deal. Some religions and belief sets are objectively better than others. When South Park did Mormonism, they got excommunicated. Alright, no big deal. They rip on jews and christians and never seem to get any death threats about it, and they hit those groups way harder than Islam. When they BARELY touch Islam they get tons of death threats. Muslims seem to always be blowing people up, stoning people, living in the stone age, and are generally highly more disposed to violence, aggression, and taking grave offense to seemingly minor things.

Sure there's millions of non-violent religious people, but the portion of Muslims who are violent is sharply higher than probably any other major religious group in the world. Their beliefs are the ones that most actively detract for human welfare. I wouldn't say "fuck religion", Christianity and Judaism have their evils, but in modern times they're still fairly benign and it's pretty rare for them to commit violence in the name of their religion. I don't know anything about eastern religions at all so I won't comment on it. Laws aren't solely on thousands of years old religious texts in Christian or Jewish societies, and most of the time they don't coerce otherwise secular people into obeying their laws under threats of violence. Christians in America want the rest of us to obey their rules, but it's extremely rare for anybody to get killed or hurt over this. In contrast though, oppression, tyranny, and violence in the name of Islam are very common. They deserve much more than simply to be mocked and ridiculed for their harmful beliefs, but minor infractions provoke death threats and widespread adoption of cultural relativism has convinced people that we can't objectively assess the quality of a culture's belief system. Somebody needs to just say it already:

Islam is the most destructive mainstream ideology that exists among humans today and humanity would be much better off if it had never existed. It should concern us all that it's growing quickly and we should do what we need to to contain it like we tried to contain communism. Islam is probably almost as bad as communism.

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Old 04-22-2010, 02:34 AM   #46
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I missed the premier of this episode and planned to watch the midnight re-air like they always do and they aired the scrotie mcboogerballs episode instead... maybe something did happen?
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Old 04-22-2010, 03:27 AM   #47
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naw, I was just being flip.
Wasn't toward you, I was responding to Chalky's comments. Should have quoted, I guess.
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Old 04-22-2010, 03:52 AM   #48
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Islam is certainly worse than communism in terms of its core tenets. I'm not trying to be an apologist for the horrors of so-called communist governments, but at least the philosophy was written with the liberation of oppressed people in mind. Marx and Engels never intended it to become a state religion of Stalinists and Maoists (though Bakunin rightly identified that this is where the "dictatorship of the proletariat" would lead). Communist ideas and the efforts of various communists have been a force of good to some extent in the 20th century, particularly in the labor movement and in the fascist resistance during WWII.

It could be argued, as well, that Islam has been a force of good, at least during its "Golden Age" when Arabic society was seeing huge advancements in science, math, architecture, art, and music, however the main reason for this was the the Caliphate upheld freedom of speech and religious tolerance. Islamic societies now, with their rule by literalist clerics is pretty much what Europe was at the time of the Arabic world's golden age - a stagnated society smothered under religious dogma.
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Old 04-22-2010, 03:55 AM   #49
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GUYS ITS OK IT WAS SANTA CLAUS
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Old 04-22-2010, 04:28 AM   #50
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i dont understand why people like south park tbh

primary school-level jokes(including poop, sex and racism), weekly pop-culture issue references and animation that is under the quality of flash cartoons.

someone could explain though, im not saying its shit, i just dont see the good side of it
lol u probably havent seen newer episodes then
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Old 04-22-2010, 04:34 AM   #51
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Yeah south park is a very rare case of a animated comedy show that actually got better as the years went by. The simpsons became a children's show, and Family guy just got stupid. The episodes of the past 3 years>>> the first few seasons.
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Old 04-22-2010, 04:36 AM   #52
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yeah, your observation of south park is very superficial antonio. I´ve argued with plenty of people about exactly this so I won´t go there but let me say that well you have to have seen more than just a few episodes to get that south park is not only about "primary school-level jokes(including poop, sex and racism), weekly pop-culture issue references and animation that is under the quality of flash cartoons." . I´ll be willing to give you a list of episodes that might turn you around:)

although i´ve experienced that some just don´t get/like south park even if they´ve seen quiet a few episodes.

season 13 had a few bad episodes and the last two of season 14 sucked as well.
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Old 04-22-2010, 04:47 AM   #53
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South Crap? The makers should have been executed a long time ago.
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Old 04-22-2010, 05:23 AM   #54
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I just wanted to clear one thing up - something i should have mentioned in an earlier post -
I am not trying to justify or condone what extremist muslims do. No way. I think it's fucked. But in the end, people are still people and if they are weak enough to be convinced to do things like murder folk over their beliefs, then it's really an individual lack of common sense that guides them on their questionable paths, more than a complete blindess mind control style brought about via religion.

I mean, for how many millions of muslims there are, how many kill others? Really?
Just sayin'


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Originally Posted by ConsumeAndBreed View Post
Look, here's the deal. Some religions and belief sets are objectively better than others. When South Park did Mormonism, they got excommunicated. Alright, no big deal. They rip on jews and christians and never seem to get any death threats about it, and they hit those groups way harder than Islam. When they BARELY touch Islam they get tons of death threats. Muslims seem to always be blowing people up, stoning people, living in the stone age, and are generally highly more disposed to violence, aggression, and taking grave offense to seemingly minor things.

Sure there's millions of non-violent religious people, but the portion of Muslims who are violent is sharply higher than probably any other major religious group in the world. Their beliefs are the ones that most actively detract for human welfare. I wouldn't say "fuck religion", Christianity and Judaism have their evils, but in modern times they're still fairly benign and it's pretty rare for them to commit violence in the name of their religion. I don't know anything about eastern religions at all so I won't comment on it. Laws aren't solely on thousands of years old religious texts in Christian or Jewish societies, and most of the time they don't coerce otherwise secular people into obeying their laws under threats of violence. Christians in America want the rest of us to obey their rules, but it's extremely rare for anybody to get killed or hurt over this. In contrast though, oppression, tyranny, and violence in the name of Islam are very common. They deserve much more than simply to be mocked and ridiculed for their harmful beliefs, but minor infractions provoke death threats and widespread adoption of cultural relativism has convinced people that we can't objectively assess the quality of a culture's belief system. Somebody needs to just say it already:

Islam is the most destructive mainstream ideology that exists among humans today and humanity would be much better off if it had never existed. It should concern us all that it's growing quickly and we should do what we need to to contain it like we tried to contain communism. Islam is probably almost as bad as communism.
O...k...
I mean, this is an interesting read. But dude - um, let me get this straight - you're saying that Muslims are all about tyranny, opression, etc etc right? And that Christians in the U.S don't follow these things to the same degree?
Well, that may be true (not saying there aren't some psychotic Christ believing Americans who have killed over the years...) - but the U.S is a different beast. It doesn't need it's religion to hide behind any more.
I think the way the U.S treats the world is FAR more tyrannical than Muslims. And don't most U.S leaders say they are Christians anyway?

Anyway, that is beside the point, that last comment. America (or at least, the way the people who run it act within the world in relation to control, the dealing of death, etc), to me, whilst it isn't technically an "ideology" - is a more destructive force than the Muslim realm. I mean, should we paint all Americans with the same brush as the ones who make all the heinous decisions?

I think religion is FUCKED when it turns people into nonsensical, crazed loons. If it is simply a way to help guide ones life, have inner peace, etc i really don't see the harm.
To me, it's like saying "I think noone should be into football. It is pointless. It has no relevance to our existence, and all these people follow it fanatically and it does nothing to in any way enhance their lives or intelligence. It should be stopped, it gives people inspiration and dreams, it is wrong".
If you get what i mean...

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If you can't see the difference between myopic, hateful, bigoted, (oftentimes Christian) imperialists and the atheist/agnostic/anti-theist who has a REASONED antipathy for one of the most shameful symptoms of human ignorance (but not all the human beings themselves), then I'm afraid you're a wishy-washy apologist. Not that the two are mutually exclusive (well except for being Christian and anti-theist), but there are plenty of good reasons to despise religion that don't also involve being callous toward human beings.
I don't understand you, or this angle. People complain about religion and the problems it has brought the world...but seriously, religion or not, there was and will always be things that cause us problems. Massive problems. I think blaming religion is just a convenience, an easy way not to have to feel in any way responsible for the woes of the world, in many circumstances.
It is just another thing which so many are a part of, and yet fail to understand not everyone needs to feel the same way. It is like a discussion - one person sees things one way, and someone else another way. And sometimes, neither are right, or neither are wrong - but either one, they can still have a heck of a fight about it, so sure of their own misguided angle.

You can think what you want of me - i just believe that religion is not all bad. There are many good things it teaches (some religions are probably a bit better than others i guess, message wise, not wanting to sound a tad hypocritical but yeah), and helps people to feel safe and alive.
I don't subscribe to this stuff, but i don't mind if people do - as long as their beliefs do not harm others purposefully or by default via outlandish ignorance.
I think everyone has the right to feel how they want.
It is just the religious types who go beyond simply being part of their religion to being a spear in a pointless battle that ruin it really.

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Old 04-22-2010, 05:27 AM   #55
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And just to add, i mean - once again, i am not trying to say there's nothing bad about religion. There is. For sure there is. I am just saying not everyone follows the same angles and acts the same way. There is good and bad everywhere.
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Old 04-22-2010, 06:22 AM   #56
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In as non-republican, non-Christian, non-imperialist and non-jingoist a sentiment as possible, fuck Muslims.
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Old 04-22-2010, 06:22 AM   #57
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speech
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Old 04-22-2010, 06:34 AM   #58
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Well, that's why you're clueless. Even if you ignore all the corrupting influences humanity has on religion and take it in its purest form, it's still a disease on society. Simply believing in god, with none of the other baggage associated with any of the organized religions, is still the promotion of superstition. It has no basis in reality and no place in a civilized society that values the pursuit of knowledge and wishes to continue to advance. There's no way around the fact that at its core, religion is inherently flawed. Just by saying you believe in a higher power you're choosing ignorance. And ignorance is bliss, and maybe some people can get some benefit out of it, but that doesn't change the fact that it still has no factual basis, is merely placating our fears instead of dealing with them, and is indicative of an extremely flawed and problematic way to view existence. Of course once you add human nature into the equation it gets even worse and more dangerous, but it's bad from the start.


Two of my new favorite quotes from you:


I know you like to sit on your little sheltered island where you have no real understanding of/interaction with the real world, where you never have to bother thinking for yourself because you prefer having your parents/government/god making all your decisions for you, and pretend to be open-minded and tolerant...but you're just really fucking ignorant.

What's the other side that's worth considering? We should be more understanding towards the lunatics who threaten to kill people for drawing cartoons mocking their bullshit beliefs? This isn't 9/11 where you can make the argument that there's lots of other factors that need to be taken into account when you consider the terrorist's actions. This is simply ignorant nutjobs threatening to kill people for mocking their beliefs. Whether you think them mocking Islam is uncalled for or not is irrelevant. Most of us live in a society which values the free expression of ideas over whether people might get their feelings hurt. The fact that your first response was "those guys know the risks" shows what a piece of shit you are and that you really are a cancer on our society. And if you think this is simply an isolated incident that shouldn't be taken seriously, you really are out of touch and should try watching the news more.

And stop sending me PMs crying about censorship. Changing your name isn't censorship, you can still freely post all of your retarded thoughts for us to read and continue to become an even bigger joke than you already are.

And South Park has never been funny.
If you're just going to choose certain things i wrote to reply to, why even bother?.

Lets look at your first "paragraph".
You talk about a world who wants to advance...well, we've been moving away from religion of recent times right? Surely we can agree on this?
And...how much better are we? Is it a marked difference? Or will it take time?
Because to me, i think the world is the worst it has ever been. Noone seems to give a FUCK about anything. Just continuing to pollute, destroy, control, etc etc as we've been doing for a long time now. But it's just getting out of a hand. I think the way we are travelling nowadays has VERY little to do with religion, at least not from the angle i have just been referring to.
We are ruining an amazing place you know. Fucking petty squabbles between its inhabitants is are fucking irrelevant.

And you think i am isolated?
How much do you travel? How much of the world have you seen? Do you think because you live in America, where apparantly everything happens, that you have a higher perch on which to judge?
Noone makes my decisions. I read and see things and i form opinions based on this shit.
You are actually more of a sheep than i had realised - i thought you had some original elements, but it seems not. Keep living in your world dude, keep fighting the good fight - it's really helping some folks out.

You see, the way to fix things is to attain and distribute knowledge. You cry "free country/free speech", and yet in the same breath "destroy religion" is just as likely to come from your mouth.
And this is the sort of thing that CAUSES conflict, from all sides. The idea that one concept is superior to another. The idea that to fix things you must first destroy what is false. We've tried this, countless times throughout history - how well has it worked?
You cannot seem to put yourself in another persons shoes, you seem not to have empathy.
You are one eyed, misguided, and quite possibly straight out selfish.
Your belief is the only belief, and anything less isn't good enough.
Fucking pathetic.

Last edited by Dr. Kang Mao-pang; 04-22-2010 at 06:37 AM..
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Old 04-22-2010, 08:00 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by Johnny-Skinless View Post
South Crap? The makers should have been executed a long time ago.
wtf
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Old 04-22-2010, 08:19 AM   #60
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OMG Coma is so hardcore telling that religious guy off! Bet he goes to Underoath concerts and tells them God doesn't exist too! That's almost too HARDCORE for me guys! I mean what if GOD exists and he reads SMN? Man, Coma is going to hell so bad, but he's hardcore and tough, he can take it, right guys? I'm scared!

Wait, that religious guy is Chalky? OH WOW, AHAHAHAHA! 10/10 name change.

Last edited by Szadou; 04-22-2010 at 08:24 AM..
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